The Insights from Insight interview series aims to gather the collective wisdom of the most accomplished and seasoned General Managers and CEOs in transit and transportation. These men and women have spent their entire careers leading and managing, steeped in the dual challenges of daily chaos and daily execution. Insight Strategies works in many industries, none are quite like transportation. We believe it takes great talent to just make it in this industry. The people we interview have not only “made it” but have thrived. Their stories and the lessons we can gain from them are presented here.
(KC) Is this a good idea John, would you have liked to hear from Senior Managers and GM’s as you were coming up? (JC) Absolutely. The history of how did we get where we are, and how did we deal with the issues? Dealing with adversity –I’m not aware of a management book that deals with key transit management issues. I think it’s a good idea.
(KC) John, it is one thing to be fired up when you’re 30 years old and you’ve taken on your first real leadership position. How does one fire (in your case) himself up and go after it when they’re 50 plus? (JC) Actually it’s a lot easier. When you’re 30 you’re trying to learn and figure things out, you haven’t really mastered the whole political process. You understand the finances, but you’re still getting your feet wet in managing the organization. So as you get older you have a broader perspective that is far more politically complex and you only get that through experience. You can read all the books you want to read, go to all the lectures you want to, but nothing prepares you like experience. At 50 you say I’ve been there, I’ve done that, now I want to take on something larger. It doesn’t mean you’re going to do it right all the time, it doesn’t mean you won’t make mistakes, but you know enough about how to back your way out of a corner.
Insights from Insight–John’s point about managing the political complexities of the GM role is an area I think a lot of would be GM’s would be wise to study and get mentoring on.
(KC) If you were to define down to one thing you can do as a GM that genuinely affects culture down to the driver, mechanic, bus washer, what is that one thing? (JC)Stephen Covey and Tom Peters used to say decades ago, you have to manage by walking around. You interact with employees at all levels in formal and informal situations. Talk to them about what they’re doing, what the agency is doing, how important it is for them to do their job, what it means for the region, for the customers. Show your personal commitment to them. It’s one-on-one and group meetings with employees to talk, trade ideas, and listen. That way you can deal better when a crisis occurs because you have their input of what’s happening in all parts of the organization. They like to get updates on what’s happening in the agency, what’s coming up. Nothing beats that interaction. Meet with the drivers, it’s easy to go out 8 to 5, but you’ll gain the greatest respect early (4:00-5:00am) when the operators get in, or after midnight when the mechanics come in for the late shift. They’ll truly appreciate your sacrifice, your commitment, and your passion. You also need to communicate that you expect them to do well.
Insights from Insight –Solid gold. Each of us should be looking for these seemingly small opportunities to connect with our team at all levels. It’s a twofer. 1. You are seen and present and not just the 9 to 5 shifts. 2. Ask and you will get some tremendously valuable “rubber on the road” performance and anecdotal data from your people.
(KC)What advice would you give a young person who wants to develop and move up? (JC) If I see a young person that has talent, lots of drive, whom I think (or who tells me) they want to be a GM or a top executive within transit, I’m going to remember them. I am going to make sure that they’re in the job that helps the agency and helps develop them. That’s talent I don’t want to lose. If someone approaches me like that I’m going to snatch them up, and put them in a special development program. I call those “champions” people who are very talented, and driven. I would put them in charge of special projects that were completely outside their area of expertise, because they had the ability to get things done. I would place them in positions that really stretched them, stretched their knowledge, but stayed within their abilities. As a result, you have great employees who are very loyal to the organization because someone cares about them, and the organization gains because it takes its internal talent and places it in a position of long-term leadership for the authority. What I mean by that is, if you see talent, and you start developing it, you’ll have that talent for a long time in the organization. Sometimes you lose people because they’ll go to another organization for a higher position if the positions aren’t open in your organization. But that’s good because you’re developing leaders for the industry. In addition, the reputation gets communicated that you are an agency who cares about its employees and their development. So then even more talented people want to come to your agency. If I can’t take someone personally under my wing I find someone high up to mentor them.
Insights from Insight-It’s one thing to hope that you will be seen and heard by your upper management. It’s another altogether to politely but clearly state that you are wanting to grow, to make a career out of transit, to ask for mentoring and counsel as to how to get there. CEO’s usually got to that position because at one time they were that hungry young exec who wanted more. My experience is that they welcome that kind of drive in their young managers and up and comers.
(KC)What advice did you get or wish you had wish you’d gotten earlier in your career. (JC) I got some great advice early in my career. James Reichart, who was the GM of OCTD (Orange County Transit District) back in the 70’s, he always talked about values. That it’s about the values of the organization that make it successful, and he kept drilling that. He would teach it and have speakers come out to speak to the management team. I started “drinking the kool-aid,” because it resonated with me. You can’t learn too early about respecting your people, developing your people, accountability, excellence, quality service and safety. Mainly the soft skills of working well with people, focusing on values, and that impacted me tremendously. Around the same time period, I got feedback from a board member and when the agency became OCTA, James’s replacement, that my strength was creating a positive work environment, while developing and respecting people. So hearing that, I emphasized that aspect of my behavior. He also told me “Smile more when you speak.” I’m serious.
Insights from Insight – Funny, now it’s considered new thinking to figure out one’s strengths as John did, and to emphasize them vs. always fixing perceived weaknesses. My/our only caveat to that is that strengths are only strengths if they are considered such by the organization itself. Same goes for weaknesses. While it is important to understand your strengths and weaknesses, it is critical that you understand them within the context of what your team, group, company need from you.
(KC)If someone were to ask you John “what questions should I be asking you, from where you sit”, what would they be? (JC)What skill sets do I need to develop in order to manage a complex organization like a transit agency? And what can I do to develop those skills? Generally I’m looking for that person to tell me they would like to take on responsibility in an area or in a task that will help develop those skills. One might say communication skills are important, but communicating to an elected board, how do you do that, how do you handle that? How do you handle adversity? How do you handle negative things that happen? How do you handle the press? How do you handle all the balls that are up in the air? Those are the kind of questions to be asking. Ask me for examples of things I had done which, if I could go back in time, what would I do different. Because in all of our careers when we make decisions, sometimes we make some pretty damn dumb ones. As a leader we have to take risks, if we don’t try new things we won’t be successful. And sometime when you try new things, they don’t work well. I would expect someone to ask me what went wrong and not just what went right. And how did I turn it around? How did I turn that lemon into lemonade?
(KC)Do you have a favorite quote or philosophy on leadership and development that you tend to go back to? (JC) Yes, I remember Steven Covey – I always liked him, I know that’s old school. For me it’s basically about the emotional bank account. And I don’t remember the exact quote now, you know you can fill up that bank account, but you have to use it very wisely. It’s not you know, you can spend all your dollars there and nothing’s left. I think he gave the example of a person who came in like with a gun shooting a 6 shooter, and it’s choosing when it’s the best time to you know give out your opinion. Which might not be, you know, the flavor of the day if you think it’s best for someone to hear. If you’re a person who constantly criticizes and says “that’s not going to work” or “no that’s not the way,” then people aren’t going to listen to you. But, if you’re a person who is supportive and in a way they say “have you thought about this approach,” then people listen, they take that into consideration. Don’t keep firing off at the mouth. Give input, give differing opinions selectively. So you’re not perceived as a person who just criticizes anything and people stop listening to you.
Insights from Insight-Steven Covey – Emotional Bank Account
Covey identifies six ways to make deposits (or reduce withdrawals):
1) Understanding the Individual – This means listening intently to what the other person is saying and empathizing with how they may feel. It’s important to care for others and act with kindness toward them.
2) Keeping Commitments – How do you feel when someone arrives right on time when you have a meeting? How about when people simply do what they say they will do? You build up an emotional reserve by keeping your commitments.
3) Clarifying Expectations – We are not mind readers, and yet we consistently expect others to know what we expect of them. Communicating our expectations can help create a higher level of trust. When we ask for what we want, and we get it, we can then trust a little more.
4) Attending to the Little Things – Don’t you find that the little things tend to become the BIG things when they do not receive our attention? Doing the little things is how we honor and show respect for others. Small kindnesses, a smile, a little extra effort, a hug, doing something you didn’t “have” to: these are the things that build trust.
5) Showing Personal Integrity – Integrity is the moral floor upon which trusting relationships are built. When we operate with sound moral character, it makes it so easy for others to trust us.
6) Apologizing When We Make a Withdrawal – We will make mistakes; it’s part of life. But when you see you have violated a trust, sincerely apologizing is how we make a deposit to counteract the damage we have done.
(KC)John, this has been very powerful, I am appreciative of your time. (JC) Thank you, I’m honored.
Final thoughts from Insight Strategies – When Managers move upwards we often find they are not fully prepared for what awaits. How could they be? While there are many philosophies floating around each individual’s capabilities coupled with the unique circumstances of the persons, places and things involved in that move create limitless challenges. Think of a fresh supervisor with no training or experience. How would he/she know to be aware of human resentments, of the shifting from being a peer to accountability for your peers? It’s a big leap and most don’t make it. This one simple example is really not that different than the newer GM? Fired up, ready to roll, finally be able to do it their way, only to find that it is a misnomer. The GM at the top of a transit property has more bosses than ever. City, boards, assemblies, and the mayor are all stakeholders in the success or failure of the GM’s actions and consequently very interested in how she/he does their job. John speaks well to the facilities needed to manage those complex relationships. Truly something difficult to learn without having been there. His understanding that we all have KPI’s, measurements and these are honorable and clearly important… buses need to roll. But the great ones, those GM’s that leave a lasting legacy to their agencies and the many people whom they impact, spend as much time on the people aspect, the human KPI’s, if you will, as any other part of their work.
Thank you, Kevin Catlin
For over three decades John B. Catoe, Jr. contributed greatly to the extension and enhancement of public transportation offerings throughout the U.S.
He was tireless in his effort to raise transit awareness, secure governmental funding, and invest in local communities. As such, under his leadership, improvements to transportation infrastructures had been realized, transit service reach more areas serving a greater number of passengers, and fiscal responsibility had been restored.
Named Outstanding Public Transportation Manager in 2009 by the American Public Transportation Association (APTA), Catoe made national headlines for orchestrating and executing safe, efficient, and reliable public transportation offerings to and from the 56th presidential inauguration events. Then, serving as the General Manager for the Washington Metropolitan Area Transit Authority (WMATA), Catoe heeded President Obama’s call to make these events the most open and accessible in history, opening METRO services to include 23 special rapid bus corridors and extended rush hour service for 17 continuous hours. Catoe served as the general manager for WMATA from 2007 through 2010, holding oversight of a $2 billion budget with more than ten thousand employees. During his tenure, he developed plans and secured funding for capital improvements to infrastructure, all while reducing administrative costs. Prior to his post at WMATA, Catoe served as the Deputy Chief Executive Officer for the Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority (Metro) from 2001 to 2007. Under Catoe’s leadership, METRO’s operating costs were tracked lower than the consumer price index for the first time in two decades. One particular focus was Catoe’s work with five Los Angeles County Councils of Governments to restructure bus operations into service sectors, thus better serving the community while containing costs, a rare feat then and now.
Those of us at Insight Strategies know John as a mentor, a man of immense integrity and we hope, a friend.
